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HelpIs Dakota an Offensive name?
I have always loved the native American culture as a child and I have some native American in me. I want to name one of my twin boys Dakota, in honor of the culture and remembrance and example to show a way of life that I personally find full of knowledge. But I get told all the time to not use it because native Americans find it offensive. Mind you this is from people saying "native Americans find Dakota a very offensive name" which in tells that the person saying this has no true knowledge of the native Americans opinion on the name Dakota due to the fact that they clearly stated they have no connection by race/ethnicity, rhyme or reason to say otherwise if someone they don't know likes or dislikes the name. If you are native American do you find the name offensive? Do you agree with my reasoning for wanting to name my son Dakota?
Thank you. - Sierra
Thank you. - Sierra
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My dd knows a girl in school with a strong link to the Cheyenne tribe on her maternal side and yet her mother named her Cheyenne. I'll admit that shocked me at first that her parents would do something like that. Have to say, naming my child after a people feels wrong to me. OTOH, names such as Cheyenne and Dakota are fairly common so obviously, a lot of people don't mind the associations. Are they offensive to some? I'm sure they are.
BTW, I do have a NA background. My ggm was full blood Blackfoot. Despite the rather obvious physical appearance of my gm, my mom and my aunt and uncles, I never felt a strong connection to that background since it was never discussed much (which is sad in retrospect) so I don't feel overly sensitive when parents use names such as Dakota. Would I ever do it myself? Nope.
As for you, I'd say do what feels right to you. Obviously, many people don't mind and you cannot please everyone.
BTW, I do have a NA background. My ggm was full blood Blackfoot. Despite the rather obvious physical appearance of my gm, my mom and my aunt and uncles, I never felt a strong connection to that background since it was never discussed much (which is sad in retrospect) so I don't feel overly sensitive when parents use names such as Dakota. Would I ever do it myself? Nope.
As for you, I'd say do what feels right to you. Obviously, many people don't mind and you cannot please everyone.
This message was edited 8/24/2015, 5:01 AM
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It's appropriating. Your background and sentiments aren't relevant to that. It's up to you whether you care enough to not use a name you like because it might be resented or seem ignorant. Personally I think Dakota is so thoroughly appropriated that naming one more kid Dakota is harmless.
This message was edited 8/23/2015, 7:51 PM
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Although I am not personally offended by the name, it comes across as painfully ignorant. It has baggage, whether you or I think it's offensive or not, and no matter how much you love Native culture and what percentage of Native American you have, it has been identified as having the potential to be considered offensive. That's just the way it is, and you gotta be prepared to deal with people possibly being offended if you use it. Caveat emptor, I guess.
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No, I don't find it offensive and whoever claims otherwise, is ridiculous.
I've known two people with this name; one boy, the other a girl. (I definitely view it as unisex) neither of them ever had any problems about having an "offensive name" and the fact that many Americans (including caucasions) have some level of native american blood in them, I think people should just get over the origin of the name already.
Dakota is a usable name and if you wish to use it, have at it. I think it's very nice. Good name choice (:
What would his twin be named? Dakota & ____?
I've known two people with this name; one boy, the other a girl. (I definitely view it as unisex) neither of them ever had any problems about having an "offensive name" and the fact that many Americans (including caucasions) have some level of native american blood in them, I think people should just get over the origin of the name already.
Dakota is a usable name and if you wish to use it, have at it. I think it's very nice. Good name choice (:
What would his twin be named? Dakota & ____?
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This talk of many European-Americans having some level of Native American blood and all European-Americans saying they do got me curious so I've been trying to find some kind of data on it. I finally found that five million European-Americans have genomes that are at least 1 percent Native American in origin. Not so very many relatively speaking and not so very much NA ancestry.
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Personally, I'm not offended by it, since I think its usage was inspired by the states North and South Dakota (which are both named after the tribe) rather than the tribe itself. From what I've heard, North Dakota and South Dakota are both beautiful places. I don't care for the name, though. (A lot of places in the US seem to be named after tribes.) I think of Dakota going more along with names like Montana, Indiana, and Arizona.
Ethnic names as personal names aren't exactly a new thing. Sabina is derived from the Sabines, and Judith is derived from the Judeans.
Ethnic names as personal names aren't exactly a new thing. Sabina is derived from the Sabines, and Judith is derived from the Judeans.
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I am not Native American - I'm not even American.
But I think people should call children whatever they want (profanity and the ridiculous excluded) and if others are offended by it that is their problem.
Well, this is from the part of myself that would love to have a little Lucifer.
But I think people should call children whatever they want (profanity and the ridiculous excluded) and if others are offended by it that is their problem.
Well, this is from the part of myself that would love to have a little Lucifer.
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Do you even know what tribe your Native American ancestry comes from? I wouldn't use it.
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Cherokee and Blackfoot. My great grandpa told me that before he passed when I was 8 because we were learning about native americans for the first time.
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I don't feel it is my place to decide. However, the fact that you have some small fraction of native American ancestry (seems like every other American claims this..) doesn't make it not cultural appropriation of a marginalised and oppressed people. You make it sound like you want the name because it's honouring the tribe, although it doesn't seem like they will see it that way.
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I don't think Dakota is a good name for a child as it doesn't really make sense when applied to an individual. It is also very broad to say you want a "Native American" name, as there are many different tribes that use names in very different ways.
This link describes why names like Dakota and Cheyenne might be considered offensive, and why using certain spiritual names would be even worse. It also gives some other examples of names that may be better to use to honor a culture. http://www.tribaldirectory.net/articles/american-indian-baby-names.html
This link describes why names like Dakota and Cheyenne might be considered offensive, and why using certain spiritual names would be even worse. It also gives some other examples of names that may be better to use to honor a culture. http://www.tribaldirectory.net/articles/american-indian-baby-names.html
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I'm pretty skeptical of this site, mostly because it gives no tribal affiliation for the names it suggests. As you say, and as we all know, there is no one "Native American language" and any half-serious researcher on Native American names would have pointed this out in their article, and would have noted which language the listed names are from.
I also raised my eyebrows at this generalization: " ... Native Americans find this trend offensive ..."
While it's true that many Native Americans find it offensive to one degree or other when non-Native Americans use such names, especially when they claim the name means something it doesn't, or clearly do not know the significance of the name, to say that we ALL find the trend offensive is a big overstatement. Names like Dakota and Cheyenne are popular across the board, and I can attest from personal experience that Indians (many of us prefer that term) do use those names, even when they don't belong to those particular tribes.
Also, Agwe is "native American" for water? Which language? Which tribe? And how come it's so very close to the Spanish agua?
I also raised my eyebrows at this generalization: " ... Native Americans find this trend offensive ..."
While it's true that many Native Americans find it offensive to one degree or other when non-Native Americans use such names, especially when they claim the name means something it doesn't, or clearly do not know the significance of the name, to say that we ALL find the trend offensive is a big overstatement. Names like Dakota and Cheyenne are popular across the board, and I can attest from personal experience that Indians (many of us prefer that term) do use those names, even when they don't belong to those particular tribes.
Also, Agwe is "native American" for water? Which language? Which tribe? And how come it's so very close to the Spanish agua?
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Ha, yeah I realized after I posted it that it wasn't the best resource for names. But I stand by the explanation of why Dakota and Cheyenne might not be the best names to use, and advice to go about researching a name that fits your particular culture if you feel so inclined to honor it.
I do think most white Americans who like Dakota just like the sound of it, but look deeper for an excuse to justify it.
I do think most white Americans who like Dakota just like the sound of it, but look deeper for an excuse to justify it.
This message was edited 8/23/2015, 7:56 AM
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those are also ...
Place names, and place names in general, and especially western ones, like Sierra, Dakota, Montana, Cheyenne and the like are pretty popular.
Place names, and place names in general, and especially western ones, like Sierra, Dakota, Montana, Cheyenne and the like are pretty popular.
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If you really like a name for a child, you are free to use it - and I hope you will based on your feelings. Many folks will dislike a name for any reason--and some reasons are predictable, while others may be unexpected. I do not see that you intend to offend a particular person, or a particular people, but to honor your son with your heritage - a heritage you'd like to share with him.
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I feel like I'm always seeing this as a defence when someone wants to use a name like Dakota, but the thing is every white American I've encountered claims to have some Indian American blood in them, so it's kind of meaningless, and not really "reasoning". Nor is having an interest in the culture.
I wouldn't risk using the name myself. It's one thing, to reference the example Jennifer shared, to use the name of a culture if you are of that culture, it's another if you aren't. For every person from the culture who is going to be flattered, or just not care, there will be another who you're going to offend. It's pretty popular, though, so you won't be the first one to have done it - just don't think that makes it any better.
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Many caucassion Americans actually do have native american descent in them. Even if its a small percentage such as 2% or 5%
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Right. Okay. That's not really the point I was making and it doesn't make the usage of the name any less potentially offensive or more reasonable. 5% is nothing.
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Then let me go in another direction: some people use the name because they just like it. They like the sound of it and could care less about the origin behind it.
One shouldn't have to have a large percentage of N.A in them just to use this now ordinary name. Or even better yet, one doesn't have to have any N.A in them to receive this name
Dakota is currently #360 among boys and #285 among girls. Obviously many people don't view this name as "offensive"
I understand people disliking it but claiming it to be offensive is something I have to disagree with.
Byes!
One shouldn't have to have a large percentage of N.A in them just to use this now ordinary name. Or even better yet, one doesn't have to have any N.A in them to receive this name
Dakota is currently #360 among boys and #285 among girls. Obviously many people don't view this name as "offensive"
I understand people disliking it but claiming it to be offensive is something I have to disagree with.
Byes!
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*eye roll*
I like how just as you try to start an argument, you cut the other person off. Every. Damn. Time. Come on, MazeRunnerFan!
I like how just as you try to start an argument, you cut the other person off. Every. Damn. Time. Come on, MazeRunnerFan!
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Um....? I'm actually really confused. What argument?
All I'm trying to say is that I don't view the name as offensive. And yet you have to bite my head off. I don't know what you mean by "cutting the other person off" or "mazerunnerfan" Really I don't.
Apparently you are misunderstanding my previous tone and misenturpreting my words so to have some level of peace, let's just drop and forget the entire conversation. OK? I'm really sorry.
There's nothing to get worked up about here. Enjoy the beautiful weather.
All I'm trying to say is that I don't view the name as offensive. And yet you have to bite my head off. I don't know what you mean by "cutting the other person off" or "mazerunnerfan" Really I don't.
Apparently you are misunderstanding my previous tone and misenturpreting my words so to have some level of peace, let's just drop and forget the entire conversation. OK? I'm really sorry.
There's nothing to get worked up about here. Enjoy the beautiful weather.
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Please don't end a post with "Byes!" If you really didn't know already, it's very obnoxious. It implies that you are not willing to read anything further and that you are determined to have the last word, and it's doubly obnoxious because you started the discussion to begin with. So it smacks of, "I really don't like you answering me."
All so easy to claim later "I don't know what you mean, I really don't" and "Apparently you are misunderstanding my previous tone". Pfffft.
All so easy to claim later "I don't know what you mean, I really don't" and "Apparently you are misunderstanding my previous tone". Pfffft.
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yup...As if I wish to stick around for the encore. you aren't going to like this and I could care less (:
Um...I really love how everyone attacks me for my "wrong doings" and yet you guys are free to say whatever you damn please.
It's really obnoxious. Really, it is. I already appologized, just drop the conversation and move on. I even stated that lol! I mean I just love how people are so quick to gang up on me and take the other persons side due to one fact that the other individual has been a long time member of this site. "Let's gang up and treat the more newer member like garbage" Essentially that's what it feels like. You guys are free to express yourself however you feel-regardless of how rude or snotty it may be. God forbid if I were to do that...
The point is I already apologized and stated to move on from the conversation. So why do you wish to carry it on? You guys can have your fun, talking crap about me and how I am severely wrong with my side because apparently you guys must have nothing better to do. I'm not saying that I am fully right or always am right but the constant calling me out for every miniscule & irrelevant thing is incredibly obnoxious and snotty. If you think I'll stop expressing myself however I wish whenever I get called out, you are poorly mistaken. It only makes me do it again. If the call outs stop, I'll be more than happy to be a more pleasant person (:
Yes I am opinionated and defensive because I'm not a mat you can walk all over. I don't do nice when others are being rude.
It really is not my fault that the other user viewed the conversation as me "arguing" or even being "rude" all I was trying to say is that I don't view the name as offensive. What's with the 3rd degree???
Also, please don't tell me how to word things as though I'm a child. If I wish to end with "Byes" I can. To explain why I wrote that is very simple: I was done with the conversation (well now I am) and didn't wish to extend it. Honestly, why would I wish to carry on the conversation when its turning real sour?? Whatever I say, they're just going to take the wrong way.
Um...I really love how everyone attacks me for my "wrong doings" and yet you guys are free to say whatever you damn please.
It's really obnoxious. Really, it is. I already appologized, just drop the conversation and move on. I even stated that lol! I mean I just love how people are so quick to gang up on me and take the other persons side due to one fact that the other individual has been a long time member of this site. "Let's gang up and treat the more newer member like garbage" Essentially that's what it feels like. You guys are free to express yourself however you feel-regardless of how rude or snotty it may be. God forbid if I were to do that...
The point is I already apologized and stated to move on from the conversation. So why do you wish to carry it on? You guys can have your fun, talking crap about me and how I am severely wrong with my side because apparently you guys must have nothing better to do. I'm not saying that I am fully right or always am right but the constant calling me out for every miniscule & irrelevant thing is incredibly obnoxious and snotty. If you think I'll stop expressing myself however I wish whenever I get called out, you are poorly mistaken. It only makes me do it again. If the call outs stop, I'll be more than happy to be a more pleasant person (:
Yes I am opinionated and defensive because I'm not a mat you can walk all over. I don't do nice when others are being rude.
It really is not my fault that the other user viewed the conversation as me "arguing" or even being "rude" all I was trying to say is that I don't view the name as offensive. What's with the 3rd degree???
Also, please don't tell me how to word things as though I'm a child. If I wish to end with "Byes" I can. To explain why I wrote that is very simple: I was done with the conversation (well now I am) and didn't wish to extend it. Honestly, why would I wish to carry on the conversation when its turning real sour?? Whatever I say, they're just going to take the wrong way.
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The trouble is
Every time you could do with changing your attitude, you just change your posting name instead, and you think we're all too stupid to notice. You are as aware of your attitude as everyone else is and unless you change it, you will continue to get pulled up on it, no matter how many times you change your username.
You started the conversation (as you do most, if not all, of the time) so you should damn well be able to handle the response, especially one so simple and inoffensive as mine in this thread, instead of petulantly cutting the other person off with a "goodbye", or whatever term you choose to employ.
You're not ganged up on, firstly, at all, and, secondly, certainly not because you're new here (you aren't). People pull you up because you're damn rude and always have been on these boards.
Every time you could do with changing your attitude, you just change your posting name instead, and you think we're all too stupid to notice. You are as aware of your attitude as everyone else is and unless you change it, you will continue to get pulled up on it, no matter how many times you change your username.
You started the conversation (as you do most, if not all, of the time) so you should damn well be able to handle the response, especially one so simple and inoffensive as mine in this thread, instead of petulantly cutting the other person off with a "goodbye", or whatever term you choose to employ.
You're not ganged up on, firstly, at all, and, secondly, certainly not because you're new here (you aren't). People pull you up because you're damn rude and always have been on these boards.
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You won't like this either
Our relative ages have nothing to do with it. I would say the same thing to someone my age or older. Yet you seem to believe that because I am significantly older than you are, somehow that means I lose the right to advise you on a breach of etiquette, that it automatically makes it "silly" and "sad" and I should "know better."
You know what that is? It's rank ageism at its worst. "Go back to your knitting, Grandma, you can't talk to us young people." Isn't it "sad" and "silly" when old people in their dotage who have lost all of their marbles try to argue with the young folk? Doesn't it feel good, doesn't it make you feel better about yourself, when you can shrug off what they say because what they say doesn't matter, because they're old and you're young? Doesn't it make you feel better about yourself that in all likelihood the older person is closer to the grave than you are?
Oh, maybe I shouldn't have put my birth year on my profile page. Maybe I should not have wanted it to be possible for anyone to find out how old I am, especially given the fact that I know that the vast majority here are a lot younger than I am. But I guess I had this silly idea that it doesn't matter, that as long as another person has reached the age of adulthood we can talk like equals.
I treated you like an equal but that wasn't good enough for you. You had to make a pathetic attempt to be my superior.
You being a "newcomer" has nothing to do with it, either, even if you were a newcomer. I'd say the same to a long-time regular. But you're not even the "newcomer" you claim to be. The fact is you've been here a long while. You've changed your posting name four times.
Yes, you have the right to word your posts however you like, but if you keep wording them in snotty condescending ways, after you've been warned, the owner of this site has the right to kick your ass to the curb and I hope he does. Before your latest post, I wouldn't have wished this, as I considered you nothing more than annoying, but your age-related prejudice has opened my eyes to the kind of person you really are and it goes beyond just annoying.
Our relative ages have nothing to do with it. I would say the same thing to someone my age or older. Yet you seem to believe that because I am significantly older than you are, somehow that means I lose the right to advise you on a breach of etiquette, that it automatically makes it "silly" and "sad" and I should "know better."
You know what that is? It's rank ageism at its worst. "Go back to your knitting, Grandma, you can't talk to us young people." Isn't it "sad" and "silly" when old people in their dotage who have lost all of their marbles try to argue with the young folk? Doesn't it feel good, doesn't it make you feel better about yourself, when you can shrug off what they say because what they say doesn't matter, because they're old and you're young? Doesn't it make you feel better about yourself that in all likelihood the older person is closer to the grave than you are?
Oh, maybe I shouldn't have put my birth year on my profile page. Maybe I should not have wanted it to be possible for anyone to find out how old I am, especially given the fact that I know that the vast majority here are a lot younger than I am. But I guess I had this silly idea that it doesn't matter, that as long as another person has reached the age of adulthood we can talk like equals.
I treated you like an equal but that wasn't good enough for you. You had to make a pathetic attempt to be my superior.
You being a "newcomer" has nothing to do with it, either, even if you were a newcomer. I'd say the same to a long-time regular. But you're not even the "newcomer" you claim to be. The fact is you've been here a long while. You've changed your posting name four times.
Yes, you have the right to word your posts however you like, but if you keep wording them in snotty condescending ways, after you've been warned, the owner of this site has the right to kick your ass to the curb and I hope he does. Before your latest post, I wouldn't have wished this, as I considered you nothing more than annoying, but your age-related prejudice has opened my eyes to the kind of person you really are and it goes beyond just annoying.
This message was edited 8/23/2015, 11:09 PM
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She's always done this
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Of course you don't. Playing innocent as you always do doesn't fool anyone - you really need to reconsider your attitude on these boards.
FYI, it was the patronising, "Byes!" that did it in this instance. Your messages are always full of passive aggressive pragmatics, especially towards me, and it is beyond irritating. I miss when you refused to reply to my posts and insisted I didn't reply to yours.
FYI, it was the patronising, "Byes!" that did it in this instance. Your messages are always full of passive aggressive pragmatics, especially towards me, and it is beyond irritating. I miss when you refused to reply to my posts and insisted I didn't reply to yours.
This message was edited 8/23/2015, 2:46 PM
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I'm a white American, and I have zero, zilch, nada NA blood in me. Am I the first? ;)
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I am 99% sure that I don't have any. There is a very slight possibility that I do have a tiny amount, if the story which my brother dug up from somewhere is true, but the possibility is so slight and the amount even if the story is true is so slight that I certainly don't go around saying I have NA blood.
I'm not sure why people would exaggerate or make this up this anyway. Is there anything shameful about being of one hundred percent European ancestry? I don't think so. When my brother and then sister-in-law told my family the story of one of our ancestors possibly being married to an Indian woman their attitude was like we were supposed to be thrilled and all of our attitudes were "So what?" lol.
I'm not sure why people would exaggerate or make this up this anyway. Is there anything shameful about being of one hundred percent European ancestry? I don't think so. When my brother and then sister-in-law told my family the story of one of our ancestors possibly being married to an Indian woman their attitude was like we were supposed to be thrilled and all of our attitudes were "So what?" lol.
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Same here. I have heard that there *might* be a tiny amount going way back, but if it's true, it's not enough to matter. I'm more German than anything.
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Yes! You really are!
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Oneidas are not related to the Cheyenne or Dakota tribes. They are separate cultures, like Scottish and Welsh.
I don't think I would have thought of them as names if I didn't already know someone with them. I think there's been some threads similar to this kind of thing, like Madison. It goes from "Why did you use it" to "Huh. Whatever" to maybe even "I really like it".
Then there are the ones about using names that aren't from your culture, and if it's okay to use those names. Would it be okay for a white person to use a Japanese name but not a Native American name that's far more popular where she lives? Why would there be a difference between the two cultures that aren't related to her?
I don't think I would have thought of them as names if I didn't already know someone with them. I think there's been some threads similar to this kind of thing, like Madison. It goes from "Why did you use it" to "Huh. Whatever" to maybe even "I really like it".
Then there are the ones about using names that aren't from your culture, and if it's okay to use those names. Would it be okay for a white person to use a Japanese name but not a Native American name that's far more popular where she lives? Why would there be a difference between the two cultures that aren't related to her?
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Ah, I made an assumption based on your phrasing. My mistake. I think it still might be less offensive than a white American using it, though, but I can't say for sure, as I'm not American, let alone Native American.
No, it wouldn't be okay.
No, it wouldn't be okay.
This message was edited 8/23/2015, 6:26 AM
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