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HelpDangereuse! And other Medieval royal names... (long)
I'm a Medieval history buff, so I was looking through some of the family trees, and I came across Eleanor of Aquitaine's. She had an... interesting family, to day the least (I used symbols to help map out who was who's issue):
PG-G-GF (paternal great-great-grandfather) #1: William V of Aquitaine *
PG-G-GM #1: Agnes of Burgundy
PG-G-GF #2: Robert I, Duke of Burgundy *
PG-G-GM #2: Ermengarde of Anjou
PG-G-GF #3: Pons, Count of Toulouse ^
PG-G-GM #3: Almodis de la Marche
PG-G-GF #4: Robert, Count of Mortain ^
PG-G-GM #4: Matilda de Montgomerie
MG-G-GF (maternal) #1: Hugues I of Châtellerault ~
MG-G-GM #1: Gerberge de La Rochefoucauld
MG-G-GF #2: Aimery IV of Thouars ~
MG-G-GM #2: Aremgarde de Mauléon
MG-G-GF #3: Archimbaud Borel de Bueil
MG-G-GM #3: Agnes de L'Isle Bouchard --
MG-G-GF #4: Eon de Blaison --
MG-G-GM #4: Tcheletis de Trèves
PG-GF #1: William VIII of Aquitaine *
PG-GM #1: Hildegarde of Burgundy *
PG-GF #2: William IV of Toulouse ^
PG-GM #2: Emma of Mortain ^
MG-GF #1: Boson II of Châtellerault ~
MG-GM #1: Alienor de Thouars ~
MG-GF #2: Barthelemy de L'Isle Bouchard --
MG-GM #2: Gerberge de Blaison --
PGF: William IX of Aquitaine *
PGM: Philippa of Toulouse ^
MGF: Aimery I de Châttellerault ~
MGM: Dangereuse de L'Isle Bouchard --
F: William X of Aquitaine
M: Aenor de Châttellerault
Eleanor (sometimes Aliénor or "alia Aenor") of Aquitaine!
Siblings:
Petronilla; called Alix or Aleith after her marriage
William Aigret; died at age 4
Eleanor's children...
With Louis VII of France:
Marie, Countess of Champagne; married, with issue
Alix, Countess of Blois; married, with issue
With Henry II of England:
William IX, Count of Poitiers; died at age 3
Henry the Young King; married, died without issue
Matilda, or "Maud", Duchess of Saxony; married, with issue
Richard I of England, or "Coeur-de-Lion"; married, died without issue
Geoffrey II, Duke of Brittany; married, with issue
Eleanor, Queen of Castile (called Leonor in Castilian); married, with issue
Joan, Queen of Sicily; married, with issue
John of England; married, with issue
Grandchildren...
By Marie:
Henry II, Count of Champagne; also King of Jerusalem, though he never used the title
Marie of Champagne, Empress Consort of Constantinople
Theobald III of Champagne
Scholastique of Champagne
By Alix:
Theobald
Louis I, Count of Blois
Henry
Philip
Margaret, Countess of Blois
Isabella
Alix, Abbess of Fontevrault
By Matilda:
Richenza, Countess of Perche and Coucy
Henry V, Count Palatine of the Rhine
Lothar of Bavaria
Otto IV, Holy Roman Emperor and Duke of Swabia
William, Duke of Lüneburg
Eleanor (died young)
Ingibiorg (daughter - died young)
By Geoffrey:
Eleanor the "Fair Maid of Brittany"
Maud of Brittany (died young)
Arthur I, Duke of Brittany (born after Geoffrey died)
By Eleanor of Castile:
Berenguela, Queen of León and Castile; also called Berengaria
Sancho (died young)
Sancha (died young)
Enrique (died young)
Urraca** of Castile, Queen of Portugal
Blanca, Queen of France; also called Blanche
Fernando; also called Ferdinand, died before attaining the throne
Mafalda; died before her marriage
Constanza, an Abbess; also called Constance
Leonor of Castile
King Enrique I of Castile
By Joan:
Bohemond, Duke of Apulia; also called Boamund
Raymond VII of Toulouse
Mary of Toulouse
Richard of Toulouse
By John:
Henry III of England; also Henry of Winchester
Richard, 1st Earl of Cornwall
Joan, Queen of Scots
Isabella, Holy Roman Empress
Eleanor, Countess of Pembroke
So... some really interesting names in this family tree. I still can't believe Eleanor of Aquitaine's grandmother's name was DANGEREUSE! And we think people get "creative" today! Gerberge, Richenza, and Tcheletis are also odd names...
EDIT--So apparently Urraca was betrothed to the King of France over her sister Blanca, originally, but Eleanor of Aquitaine objected because she hated her name (apparently "urraca" in Castilian means "magpie"), and found "Blanche" to be much more suitable. This, coming from a woman whose grandmother's name was Dangereuse...
PG-G-GF (paternal great-great-grandfather) #1: William V of Aquitaine *
PG-G-GM #1: Agnes of Burgundy
PG-G-GF #2: Robert I, Duke of Burgundy *
PG-G-GM #2: Ermengarde of Anjou
PG-G-GF #3: Pons, Count of Toulouse ^
PG-G-GM #3: Almodis de la Marche
PG-G-GF #4: Robert, Count of Mortain ^
PG-G-GM #4: Matilda de Montgomerie
MG-G-GF (maternal) #1: Hugues I of Châtellerault ~
MG-G-GM #1: Gerberge de La Rochefoucauld
MG-G-GF #2: Aimery IV of Thouars ~
MG-G-GM #2: Aremgarde de Mauléon
MG-G-GF #3: Archimbaud Borel de Bueil
MG-G-GM #3: Agnes de L'Isle Bouchard --
MG-G-GF #4: Eon de Blaison --
MG-G-GM #4: Tcheletis de Trèves
PG-GF #1: William VIII of Aquitaine *
PG-GM #1: Hildegarde of Burgundy *
PG-GF #2: William IV of Toulouse ^
PG-GM #2: Emma of Mortain ^
MG-GF #1: Boson II of Châtellerault ~
MG-GM #1: Alienor de Thouars ~
MG-GF #2: Barthelemy de L'Isle Bouchard --
MG-GM #2: Gerberge de Blaison --
PGF: William IX of Aquitaine *
PGM: Philippa of Toulouse ^
MGF: Aimery I de Châttellerault ~
MGM: Dangereuse de L'Isle Bouchard --
F: William X of Aquitaine
M: Aenor de Châttellerault
Eleanor (sometimes Aliénor or "alia Aenor") of Aquitaine!
Siblings:
Petronilla; called Alix or Aleith after her marriage
William Aigret; died at age 4
Eleanor's children...
With Louis VII of France:
Marie, Countess of Champagne; married, with issue
Alix, Countess of Blois; married, with issue
With Henry II of England:
William IX, Count of Poitiers; died at age 3
Henry the Young King; married, died without issue
Matilda, or "Maud", Duchess of Saxony; married, with issue
Richard I of England, or "Coeur-de-Lion"; married, died without issue
Geoffrey II, Duke of Brittany; married, with issue
Eleanor, Queen of Castile (called Leonor in Castilian); married, with issue
Joan, Queen of Sicily; married, with issue
John of England; married, with issue
Grandchildren...
By Marie:
Henry II, Count of Champagne; also King of Jerusalem, though he never used the title
Marie of Champagne, Empress Consort of Constantinople
Theobald III of Champagne
Scholastique of Champagne
By Alix:
Theobald
Louis I, Count of Blois
Henry
Philip
Margaret, Countess of Blois
Isabella
Alix, Abbess of Fontevrault
By Matilda:
Richenza, Countess of Perche and Coucy
Henry V, Count Palatine of the Rhine
Lothar of Bavaria
Otto IV, Holy Roman Emperor and Duke of Swabia
William, Duke of Lüneburg
Eleanor (died young)
Ingibiorg (daughter - died young)
By Geoffrey:
Eleanor the "Fair Maid of Brittany"
Maud of Brittany (died young)
Arthur I, Duke of Brittany (born after Geoffrey died)
By Eleanor of Castile:
Berenguela, Queen of León and Castile; also called Berengaria
Sancho (died young)
Sancha (died young)
Enrique (died young)
Urraca** of Castile, Queen of Portugal
Blanca, Queen of France; also called Blanche
Fernando; also called Ferdinand, died before attaining the throne
Mafalda; died before her marriage
Constanza, an Abbess; also called Constance
Leonor of Castile
King Enrique I of Castile
By Joan:
Bohemond, Duke of Apulia; also called Boamund
Raymond VII of Toulouse
Mary of Toulouse
Richard of Toulouse
By John:
Henry III of England; also Henry of Winchester
Richard, 1st Earl of Cornwall
Joan, Queen of Scots
Isabella, Holy Roman Empress
Eleanor, Countess of Pembroke
So... some really interesting names in this family tree. I still can't believe Eleanor of Aquitaine's grandmother's name was DANGEREUSE! And we think people get "creative" today! Gerberge, Richenza, and Tcheletis are also odd names...
EDIT--So apparently Urraca was betrothed to the King of France over her sister Blanca, originally, but Eleanor of Aquitaine objected because she hated her name (apparently "urraca" in Castilian means "magpie"), and found "Blanche" to be much more suitable. This, coming from a woman whose grandmother's name was Dangereuse...
This message was edited 3/31/2012, 5:48 PM
Archived Thread - replies disabled
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Replies
I love medieval history and names. This is OT, but have you ever read any of Sharon Kay Penman's books? They're historical fiction, but they're very based on historical fact. She just filled in the gaps with her own interpretation of motivations and personalities, etc. and I find it fascinating. I love her books. She has a few specifically about Eleanor of Aquitane's life, which I've never read but are on my to-read list. Then Here Be Dragons, possibly my favorite book ever, is about Llywelyn the Great but has a lot of King John and some Eleanor in there too. (John had an illegitimate daughter, also named Joan, who was married to Llywelyn). She has others which I have read and love too, but those were the ones I mostly wanted to mention!
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I was looking through this very family tree a few months ago! I love Urraca (imagine that pronounced in Spanish, with a trilled R) and Bohemond (I pronounce it in a kind of French way in my head...like bo-eh-MOHN). Also love all the Matilda / Mauds and Leonor, Aimery, Hildegarde, Archimbaud, Aigret. Dangereuse de l'Isle Bouchard is amazing!!
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Funny you should mention...
Eleanor of Aquitaine... she's my ancestor!
King Henry III and King Edward I are my ancestors as well as Eleanor of Castile :) They're all traceable in my family tree. Pretty ironic to see all of these names mentioned when I just went through my family tree and found them all LOL.
Eleanor of Aquitaine... she's my ancestor!
King Henry III and King Edward I are my ancestors as well as Eleanor of Castile :) They're all traceable in my family tree. Pretty ironic to see all of these names mentioned when I just went through my family tree and found them all LOL.
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Dude they're like everyone's ancestors
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Make sure you get supporting evidence. A lot of people post connections on genealogy websites, but don't have the backup material to prove it. and some of it is based on rumour.
I have one ancestral line where someone keeps insisting that a man married an 'Indian princess'. and another that traces back to a medieval royal line in France, but it's just one researcher who has decided that so and so is the daughter of this duke without any real proof.
The internet has made genealogy easier and fun, but not very reliable as actually tracing the records yourself.
I have one ancestral line where someone keeps insisting that a man married an 'Indian princess'. and another that traces back to a medieval royal line in France, but it's just one researcher who has decided that so and so is the daughter of this duke without any real proof.
The internet has made genealogy easier and fun, but not very reliable as actually tracing the records yourself.
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Wow, you can trace your ancestry back that far? That's awesome. My mom has traced her side of my family to the first French colonists in Quebec and a little further back to France (I think mid-1500's?). It's so interesting to find out just who your ancestors were.
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If you are lucky enough to find a child of a royal- even the illegitimate ones have a paper trail. But the farther back I went, the less I believed it. I found a tree online for some of these ancestors, and it went all the way to Marc Antony's grandfather, also Marcus Aurelius Antonius (the Latin form of his name). I also found Old King Cole from the nursery rhyme and Cybeline- Shakespeare wrote a play about this legendary Briton king. It's basically the Prodigal Son.
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We've actually got it traced back to the 500's!!! Since from the 1400's back it's royalty it's pretty easy to trace. They kept good records of the royals back then :)
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Part of me wants to say that Dangereuse was an alias. Dangereuse was a 'muse' to William the Troubadour Duke of Aquitaine. If I remember my medieval history correctly, the troubadours wrote mainly to try to get the 'muse' into their bed. If that is true, Aenor might have married her half brother.
But, I'm also descended from a bastard son of John of England and his cousin Adele. Adele's dad was the bastard son of Geoffrey Plantagenet, John's paternal grandfather.
But, I'm also descended from a bastard son of John of England and his cousin Adele. Adele's dad was the bastard son of Geoffrey Plantagenet, John's paternal grandfather.
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It would make sense if Dangereuse were an alias, because when I was reading about her I kept thinking, "Wow, she really lived up to her name!"
I don't think, however, that Aenor married her half brother, but rather her stepbrother (although I don't think William and Dangereuse ever actually married...).
I don't think, however, that Aenor married her half brother, but rather her stepbrother (although I don't think William and Dangereuse ever actually married...).
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Just because he tried to get her in his bed doesn't mean he tried to marry her.
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